So I switched to the 450 bm and never regretted it and it comes with me everywhere. Then Hornady brought out two loads for the cartridge and things changed. So youll have to buy your ammunition from the one-and-only maker, Hornady. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. I own a 450 marlin and have been happy with it. All rights reserved. (444 Marlin) 397117 45 Cal .452" 200 gr. Published Jun 15, 2021 9:00 AM EDT, We may earn revenue from the products available on this page and participate in affiliate programs. For .450 Bushmaster and .444 Marlin, you're looking at $41 to $49 per box, and .45-70 Govt. With a 150-yard zero, the bullet is 1.66 inches high at 100 yards, 4.37 inches low at 200 yards, and 11.9 inches low at 250 yards. Specifically, the 45-70 cartridge has an overall length of 2.55 and a 2.105 long case. The wood pores of the 444P were no better filled than on the other rifle. Reloading Brass. And, outside a flash hider on an AR, dont usually come with a muzzle device standard. On my chronograph. At 100 yards, that advantage is holding strong with the .450 Marlin showing an additional 701 ft-lbs of energy. In our estimation, there is no need for the cartridge, and the rifle didnt work properly. 5,270. Buy it. Marlin 1895M .450 Marlin, $560. In the end thats what counts. Bushmaster and LeGendre approved the change in case length from 1.771-inch to 1.700-inch. Contributor Brad Fenson takes to the grill, to cook up some delicious venison burgers. of muzzle energy, and that combo will handle any North American game animal. What kind of gun writer are you? The plus side of this cartridge is that recoil is pretty mild, so its a good choice for shooters who need to take recoil into consideration. The 450 bushmasters highest muzzle energy is 2743 ft/lbs of energy, 363 ft/lbs more than the Socom. New Shooters Guide: What Is a Pistol Caliber Carbine? I ended up just taking a lower I had and put a 450 upper on it with a vortex crossfire II 1-430 I think or maybe its 35 or something like that not sure but it will group at 2 inches even for an 10 shot group at 100 yards. Those unaccustomed to hard-kicking rifles will find either the .444 or the .450 a bit much on the shoulder until they get used to it. Our shooting was hampered by the trigger and by the huge ghost-ring rear sight. A behemoth by any standard, the large-bore rifle cartridge has been the go-to for many if not most hunters around the shores of Lake Michigan and Lake Erie up to this point. . (460 S&W Mag) 397118 45 Cal .452" 250 gr. Precision Reloading: Making The Best Case Possible, Best 7mm Rem. The .444 felt noticeably smoother in its action than the .450. Like firearms themselves, there's a wide variety of opinions on what's the best gun. It has been used for everything from deer to Cape Buffalo, and remains popular among the bear guides to this day. Dont Buy. I have an H&R 444 with the 16tw barrel - loaded some 240gr. Factory ammo must be safe to use in them, so the .45-70 rarely reaches its full potential. Some hunters like lever-action rifles for hunting, but they want more power than the .30-30 delivers, and so the medium-bore lever rifle cartridges were born. Archive - STARLINE BRASS - Rusty Wood Trading Co. A small point perhaps, but the action bottom at the balance point was squared on the Winchester, but nicely rounded on the Marlins, and that made the Marlin easier to carry. Save big on firearms, accessories, tactical gear, clothing, and ammunition from now until March 29. Out of the muzzle, the .450 Marlin is flying 175 ft/s faster than the .45-70 Government. New Shooters Guide: You Have Your Concealed Carry Permit Should You Carry. The .45-70 Government has quite the bullet range in comparison to the .444 Marlin; bullets will run from 250-grains all the way up to the behemoth 600-grain slugs, with a slew of choices in between. In essence the rimmed .444 Marlin is an elongated .44 Magnum (the case length is 2.225 inches, with an overall length of 2.550 inches), as it uses the same .429-inch diameter bullets as the classic revolver cartridge, albeit at a much higher velocity. Join F&S+ to read exclusive stories by your favorite writers. For a while, nobody was making rifles in .45-70 and the cartridge seemed doomed. We are constantly adding new inventory and occasionally offer Free Shipping. The .450 Bushmaster was designed to operate in AR-15 platform rifles and is capable of delivering considerably more close-range punch than the 5.56 NATO. Plenty of fanfare and spilled ink has greeted the latest and greatest do-all deer medicine. In factory loads for the 45-70 you have to mind what you are buying. Thats the exact opposite of whats in vogue with modern rifle cartridges today. The recoil of the .450 was a bit stiffer than the .444 Marlin with Buffalo Bore ammunition. Its a great round in a Marlin lever action. Then somebody figured out that straight-walled rifle cartridges are just as safe as slugs. bullets weighing 250 gr. Follow along to see exactly how. The big difference is that .308 Winchester keeps at least 1,000 ft.lbf out to about 600 yards, 450 Bushmaster loses it by 300 yards. On the other hand, the .450 Bushmaster is primarily intended for use on the semi-automatic AR platform, while it can also be chambered in bolt action rifles. All of these walnut-stocked rifles had iron sights only, which is how we tested them. The following ballistics tables show a side by side comparison of the 450 Marlin vs 450 Bushmaster based on bullet weight and performance metrics including velocity, energy, usage and recoil. Its been the hot ticket in town over the past few years, and new rifle and deer hunting ammo introductions are happening pretty fast. Get the latest news and reviews from Gundigest.com. I have a very accurate marlin with the 1/20 twist. The second shot told us that something was drastically wrong somewhere. 45-70 Govt VS 450 Bushmaster Ballistics (Trajectory, Recoil, History) The front sight was a gold-faced bead on a ramp underneath a protective hood. Our test .444 Marlin 444P was essentially a .444 Guide Gun, having the same ideas behind it as Marlins best-selling .45-70 version. The quality of bluing on the Winchester was excellent, in spite of the slight metal-polishing problems. The original loading used a 250-grain bullet with a muzzle velocity of 2200 fps from a 20-inch barrel. In terms of maximum point-blank range, its only a 16-yard difference on a 14-inch target (roughly the size of a small deers vital zone). The newer .450 Marlin is also frequently compared with it. The heavier bullets of the .450 Marlin might slow it down a bit, but they give a serious advantage when it comes to velocity. This means that it is still a niche cartridge offered by just a few manufacturers, and you might struggle to find it on the shelves of your local ammunition store. With a 150-yard zero, the Hornady 265-grain Flextip ammo is 1.55 inches high at 100 yards, 4.08 inches low at 200 yards and 11.16 inches low at 250 yards. It costs less than the Marlins and delivered excellent quality and adequate accuracy for a big-game rifle. The Winchester, thought, had a superb ghost-ring aperture sight by Ashley, which we though would give it an advantage. Perhaps with a longer barrel the ammunition might achieve its claimed 2,100 fps. The Best Black Bear Cartridges - Field & Stream Though the .45-70 Government cartridge has been in production since 1873, there was a time when a new rifle chambered in that cartridge just wasnt offered. Medium-bore lever rifles are made by Marlin and Winchester. We cant see the sense of a scope on a short, relatively light rifle, unless its done Scout-style like the Co-Pilot. Looking at this product line, youll be inclined to give the nod to the .444 Marlin, especially coupled with the Hornady Superformance load of the 265-grain InterLock at 2400 fps. Designed and developed by Winchester, the 350 Legend is the first new introduction to the market aimed specifically at straight-walled hunting regulations. | On the other hand, the Legend is available with thinner sporter contour barrels. The .450 Marlin is just a bit bigger, with a bullet diameter of .458 compared to the .450 Bushmasters .452. For you Michigan hunters, there is a new kid in town called a 460 S&W that Is awesome in a rifle. This cartridge is useless, and it may have caused a host of ejection problems in our test gun. Recoil was manageable thanks to the soft pad, but the rifle had much greater muzzle flip than the ported Marlins. The .450 Bushmaster is designed to be used in standard M16s and AR-15s, using modified magazines and upper receiver assemblies. 450 bushmaster vs 444 marlin - 24hourcampfire Few rifle calibers carry as much tradition as the .444 Marlin, which originally hit the scene as a way to give lever-action rifles more of a punch around the ammunition manufacturers stopped commercially producing .45-70-caliber rifles in the 1960s. For 450 Bushmaster, AR 15 is always the best choice. Not that it hurts to have a rifle chambered for one in your arsenal if you live big county out West. SAAMI Accepts 30 Super Carry As New Standardized Cartridge, SHOT 2022: Federal Premium Announces 30 Super Carry Cartridge. Buffalo Bore also loads three different weights of bullets in the .444 Marlin, and they give much better performance than ordinary .444 loads, and do so safely. The .450 Marlin case is 2.1 inches long.). Online pricing may vary from in-store pricing. vs. .300 Win. It goes so far as, previously mentioned, manufacturers offering the same model rifle in both .450 Bushmaster and .350 Legend. (Well cover the .35 Remington or .356 Winchester another day.) Elwood Shelton is an online content developer for Gun Digest. The .450 Bushmaster was designed by the Hornady Manufacturing Company for Bushmaster Firearms International when the latter wanted a .45 caliber cartridge that would work through the short AR-15 action. The 1895M was fitted with barrel-mounted iron sights, though it was also drilled and tapped for scope mounting. Individual Dies & Accessories - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc For all the .450 Bushmasters assets, economic shooting isnt one of them. However, if we found a gun which didnt have ejection problems like those we note below, wed upgrade that recommendation to a Conditional Buy for the pistol shooter who already owns .44 Magnums or Specials. As far as trajectory, both start to drop excessively at 200 yards, 7.58 inches on a scope zeroed for 100 yards in the .350s case and 8.96 in the .450s. Will drop a 300+lb. There were two large panels of checkering on the straight-hand grip. This straddled the bolt, but was much too far forward for proper use by our test personnel. Muzzle Energy: 2,686 foot-pounds. This one didnt work. I'm going to take a wild stab at it and say the deer wouldn't know the difference, at least within the normal operating range of both. (The .450 Marlin, by the way, is a ringer for the .458 American except for that longer belt. This cartridge has the potential to be the best deer hunting ammo of the lot. Terms of Service - Pro's Con's 450 Bushmaster AR VS 460 S&W Single Shot - Gunloads.com Though we believe the .45-70 version is a much better bet, many riflemen who also own .44-caliber handguns will want to own the .444 Marlin, and its a pretty good rifle. Big-Bore Lever-Action Hunting Guns: Pass On Marlins New .450 Winchester put decent walnut on this all-steel rifle, and did a great job of finishing and checkering the wood. Collectors might want to pick up one and never fire it, plus some ammunition, because we believe this gun will be very short-lived. While .308 can reach out accurately to 1,200 yards (if you're pretty good), 450 . By the way, if you are using ar-15, the scope for ar-15 is the good one you should had. The checkering was very well done, had a pleasing pattern, and it worked very well. There is something almost magical about big-bore lever guns; to me they represent big-game hunting at close quarters. The resulting round boasts performance on par with the .45-70 Gov't but in a more compact configuration. GunnersDen.com ~ Year-round, you can find ammo at less than 50 per round, which isnt 5.56 NATO cheap, but is thrifty. Ammo: Elk, Deer And Everything Else, 5 Best AR-10 Options You Can Actually Afford (2023), 8 On-Target Concealed Carry Insurance Options (2022), 10 Affordable Double-Barrel Shotgun Options (2022), Best AR-15 Options For Any Budget And Buyers Guide (2022), Best Concealed Carry Handguns For Women (2022). Photo Gallery See all Photos I must report that right out of the box the Outfitter G2's hammer was hard to cock, and it was very gritty and rough. While the .444 is near the bottom of the popularity list in current straight-walled rifle cartridges, I expect that will change as hunters discover the potential of this cartridge. A 265 grain 44 Mag is measured at 1180 fps with 741 ft/lb at the muzzle. We wanted to test Marlins iteration of the .450 side by side with one of the companys staple .444s, as well as Winchesters Big Bore Side-Eject lever gun, originally chambered in the now-defunct .375 Winchester, but which is now cataloged in .444 Marlin (and .356 Winchester). While I think the .444 Marlin is a sound design, there is such a diversity in the .45-70 Government makes it a logical and abundant choice for the hunter. 45/70 or 450 Bushmaster for ohio big buck | Gun and Game Forum .45-70 vs .450 Bushmaster Cartridge Clash - RifleShooter Out of the muzzle, the .250 Marlin is flying 25 ft/s faster than the .250 Bushmaster. These are two very similar calibers, and indeed both the .450 Marlin and the .450 Bushmaster are seeking to imitate the classic .45-70 Government for different purposes. If, instead, the case had been developed around a standard belted brass case, we feel consumers would ultimately be better served by the Marlin 1895M. Check out the ballistics chart below for more information. While my .444 Marlin lever-action rifle shoots just over one MOA with the Hornady ammo, like all lever actions, its not built for precision work. Rifle Type Rifle type is the major difference between the .450 Marlin and the .450 Bushmaster. The Marlins, Winchester, Brownings and Henrys all handle those big-bore cartridges well, and among them the .444 Marlin and .45-70 Government are a pair of undeniable classics. We hesitate to recommend this gun because of our rifles probably temporary, but very real, feeding problem that needed to be fixed. Certainly, some pride themselves in how much recoil they can endure. Both shed velocity like mad, the Legend losing 29-percent of its muzzle velocity at the 200-yard mark and the Bushmaster 31 percent1,648 fps and 1,515 fps respectively. vs. .340 Wby. Copyright 2023Sportsman's Warehouse. However, the trigger pull was in desperate need of work. or 260 gr. Both are straight walled cartridges, but the 45-70 has a longer overall length, a longer case length, and a larger diameter case than the 450 Bushmaster. Many lever guns have limited accuracy past 150 yards, but the .450 BM is able to perform within MOA all the way to 200 and beyond. Well, I gotta respectfully disagree with that statement. The 44 Magnum and 45 Colt are 125 yard rifles. Copyright 2023 National Rifle Association, Women On Target Instructional Shooting Clinics, Volunteer At The Great American Outdoor Show, Marion P. 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Who needs more than 1 shot? We didnt like these, having become thoroughly used to the half-cock position on hammer rifles. Fastest cartridge of these options. We eventually decided there was something seriously wrong with this rifle, and though we liked its feel, looks, and accuracy, we wouldnt buy this one. and .444 Marlin provide enough accuracy (and their bullets retain enough energy) to confidently reach out across a cut cornfield and make a 200-yard shot. The 450 would do better, but, is it needed on deer? Lets see what we found. Marlin 1895 (.450 Marlin) My uncle carried a .45-70 when he guided brown bear hunters, and several times stopped charging bears with it at close range. It is just basically a souped-up 45-70 with stronger brass and a belt to make sure it is not confused with a 45-70. I have worked pretty extensively with this cartridge on the range with three different rifles, and I have talked with a bunch of other gun guys who have been shooting the 350 Legend. Bullet Diameter: .452 inches (All .450 Bushmaster) Shell Case Length: 1.7 inches (All .450 Bushmaster) Bullet Size: 250 grains (Bullets range from 245 to 300 grains) Muzzle Velocity: 2,200 feet per second. As soon as the cartridge's proprietary status was lifted we ordered a reamer and started building barrels. In days past these included the .348, various wildcats on that theme like the .450 Alaskan, the .45-70, and numerous blackpowder-era cartridges modernized with smokeless powder. It is on the wane and has long ago been supplanted by the resurgent 45-70. As it is, we feel this odd belted design will only speed the demise of this rifle/cartridge combination, because it doesnt make the least bit of sense to us. 450 Bushmaster vs 45-70 Review & Comparison - Big Game Hunting Blog Each cartridge has its own benefit and ultimately is your choice. The case is belted, the belt being longer than normal belted magnum brass, though the same diameter. The wood at the rear of the receiver was much smaller in spots than the steel. The 450 Bushmaster was developed for use in AR-15 rifles. Why wouldnt they be in similar rifles? At the range, the first shot told us that the Marlin .450 was a powerful rifle. Use: Defense. We would not mention this but for the fact that another shooter across the country reported to us he felt the exact same thing on two different Marlins. Mag..404 Jeffery vs. .416 Rigby.243 Winchester vs. 6mm Creedmoor.300 PRC vs. .300 Win. Wed like to see Marlin spend its efforts making great rifles perfectly, rather than expending energy on useless new projects like the .450 Marlin. Throw a moose in then I would lean to the .450 but realize that these lightweight .450 carbines kick like a .375 H&H. Introduced in 1964, the .444 Marlin was kind of a stretched out .44 Magnum. Deer, hog, black bear size game. The .444 Marlin is essentially a deer rifle that can be used on black bear. Since its inception in 1964, however, many hunters . The walnut was very decent wood, nicer than that on the .450. 450 Marlin vs 45-70. At 100 yards bullet velocity slows to 1,835 and retains 1,868 pounds of energy. Straight-walled rifle cartridgesat least most of themare a lot more consistent. Privacy Statement - It generates 21.34 ft-lbs of energy at 12.55 fps. We also had problems with the function of the .450 Marlin. Shoot it enough and know what to expect and it shouldnt prove prohibitive, except to the most recoil shy. That size requires rifle, not pistol, bullets. any 450 bushmaster shooters on here | Long Range Hunting Forum But this problem never happened again. If it had been a rimmed case, sales and longevity would be higher still. Match Grade Machine did extensive testing with different barrel lengths in some of our most popular cartridges. 450 a bit better with jacketed, 1" vs 1.5". At 300 yards, it is moving 76 ft/s faster, as the .450 Marlin is able to hold onto more of its speed for longer than the .450 Bushmaster. So when it comes to the .350 Legend vs .450 Bushmaster, is there any discernable advantage of hunting one or the other? Its therefore important to keep in mind that we are comparing a 325 grain .450 Marlin against a 250 grain .450 Bushmaster--which are the commonly used bullet weights for each caliber. The .450 Marlin has quite a bit longer case, at 2.10" compared to 1.70" on the .450 Bushmaster. Our loaner was fitted with a ghost-ring Ashley aperture sight held to the receiver with two screws. Ive used a 308 and hit a branch with it and the bullet broke apart and i thankfully got a lucky hit to the neck with about half a bullet tumbling through the air. It had a plain but serviceable checkered walnut stock with trestle-style buttpad made of black rubberized iron. Why dont manufacturers get the word here? How's the recoil of the 450 Bushmaster? - Michigan Sportsman Forum For the .350 Legend, the ammo of choice is Winchester 's 150-grain Deer Season XP, with a listed muzzle velocity of 2,325 fps and a BC of .223. Here are four places to start, By 450 bushmaster vs 444 marlin - 24hourcampfire Yes, the Legend does tend to shoot a fraction flatter at distance, but not substantially so. The .45-70 was a very popular hunting cartridge, even before this straight-walled phenomenon started, but its held back by all of those old guns out there. Calibers for Beginners: .450 Bushmaster - The Truth About Guns The original rifle featured a 24" 1:38 twist microgoove (12 groove) barrel. The two most popular flavors are the .45-70 and .450 Marlin cartridges, both of . .444 Marlin vs my .450 - The Firing Line Forums The rifle was fitted with a Pachmayr Decelerator stock but had no ports. There were no aluminum or plastic parts visible, though close inspection showed the magazine follower to be orange polymer. By logging into your account, you agree to our. 450 Bushmaster can be found on the shelves at most large outfitters but don't expect to . With a 2.260-inch Maximum Overall Cartridge Length, it fits well in the AR-15 platform. The ported barrels of these rifles worked wonders to keep the muzzle down, but the rearward kick was still significant. 45-70 VS 450 Bushmaster - Side by Side Comparison